Unidentified engine


Robert Womack

Content Tools

Occasionally it comes time to look back-and in this particular case, looking back at the gas engine and tractor hobby illustrates a dramatic change over the past 25 or 30 years. It's only been about forty years since old-time threshing bees were first held, and these were relatively minor in nature. GEM's founder, the late Elmer Ritzman, started out short on money and tall on dreams with his Farm Album. The late 1940's and early 1950's were lean years indeed. In fact, gas engines and tractors were seldom mentioned-steam was still king!

Rev. Ritzman continued with his quest and followed his dream. Vintage steam power became more and more popular, as did gas engines and tractors. The latter continued growing to the point that in 1966 the original Iron Man Album reverted to a 'steam only' magazine, and the entirely new Gas Engine Magazine was launched for the benefit of gas engine and tractor collectors. In the twenty some years since GEM became a reality, it has become a major publication dealing with our hobby, and has thus helped to move gas engine and tractor restoration into a hobby with genuine credentials and public visibility. Although many visitors at the shows do not understand the original purpose or use of these machines, most of them are awed by the fact that so many different types and styles have been preserved for the future. There can be no doubt that much of the credit must go to men of vision-men like the late Rev. Elmer Ritzman.

Our first question this month deals with:

23/10/1 Q. I recently acquired a Jaeger cement mixer with a Stover engine, TB235263. What time period does this represent? Kent A. Berge, 445 E. 20th St., Costa Mesa, California, 92627.

A. The Stover engine was built June 18, 1936. It was one of 100 shipped to Chain Belt Company at Milwaukee, Wisconsin. This represents the distinct possibility that Jaeger might have built the mixer and supplied it to the Chain Belt without an engine. The latter then contracted with an engine company, in this case Stover, and attached the engine themselves.

23/10/2 Q. What is the proper paint color for a Hercules engine? Ed Minnick, RR 1, Box 140, Bainbridge, Indiana, 46105.

A. Refer to page 12 of the September, 1988 GEM.

23/10/3 Q. I have just acquired a Fuller & Johnson 3HP engine, s/n 87210.1 need information on this engine. Bill Elliott, 1731 Palmer Ave., Winter Park, Florida 32789.

A. Contact: Verne W. Kindschi, S90088 U. S. Hwy 12, Prairie du Sac, Wisconsin 53578-9723.

23/10/4 Q. I have a 22-36 McCormick Deering with s/n TG155062. What is the proper color? Tom Hall, RR 2, Box 31, Blue Mound, Illinois 62513.

A. The s/n listing shows this to be a 1932 model. We believe it to be IHC Gray, as given on page 12 of the September, 1988 GEM.

23/10/5 We frequently have collectors asking for the Reflector's home address and home phone in their quest for information. Kindly send your requests to: Reflections, Gas Engine Magazine, Box 328, Lancaster, PA 17603.

The folks at GEM photocopy your letters and information before sending it on to the Reflector. That way, should the original material get lost or damaged, there still remains a backup copy. It also permits the Reflector and the folks at GEM to communicate more easily whenever this becomes necessary. Believe us when we say that the one thousand mile separation between the GEM offices and the Reflector's office can create some unusual problems. To make a long story short, we ask you to send your correspondence into GEM for the reasons outlined above-it is one way we can keep errors to a minimum.

23/10/6Charles Kaulfurs, RD 3, Box 574, Saylorsburg, PA 18353 needs information on a Copar Panzer tractor.

23/10/7 Q. What is the proper paint color for a John Lauson engine, also the Alpha DeLaval engine built by Lauson. What is the proper color for a Fuller & Johnson? Howard Kittleson,. 425 N. 12th St., Moorhead, Minnesota, 56560.

A. We're not definitely sure on the Lauson or DeLaval colors. See September, 1988 GEM, page 12 for the F & J.

23/10/8 Q. I'm trying to repaint old cast iron implement seats, and would like to find the original colors for the following: Case, Fuller & Johnson, American Harrow, Walter A. Wood, Gale, Kingman, Buckeye (C. Aultman), Superior, Jones, Stoddard, Empire, Acme, Peoria, Grand Detour, and the like. Pembroke T. Rath-bone, Route 1, Box 734, Marsing, Idaho 83639.

A. We would guess that the best source will be some original literature on these companies. Unfortunately, some were pretty stingy with their catalogs and used woodcuts instead of color lithographs. In these cases, the true color of some machines may never be known. However, we hope that various readers having some original literature having color illustrations might share the information so that we can all benefit from same.

23/10/9 Q. I would like some information on metal preparation and painting of rusty surfaces such as motor castings and frames. Any suggestions or books would be appreciated. Donald E. Bowden, 12665 Sundance, SanDiego, California 92129.

A. DuPont puts out a nice little book entitled, Auto Refinishing Handbook. It sells for about $13, and should be available at DuPont Automotive Enamel Outlets. We presume that other paint manufacturers might also have similar titles. In addition to surface preparation techniques, the above title also delves into the proper use and necessary precautions with some of today's sophisticated finishes, especially those containing the rather dangerous isocyanates.

23/10/10Our friend Robert Womack, PO Box 292, Goldthwaite, Texas, 76844 sends in a couple of photos that successfully put us to the acid test so far as identification is concerned (See 23/10/10A and B). We'll have to concede defeat here-somehow or other this unusual design is familiar, but ye olde Reflector has yet to ascribe a name to this one. It has no valves or gears; the flywheels are 20 inches in diameter with a 23/4 inch face. The connecting rod is connected to the crosshead, and the engine has a 4x5 inch bore and stroke. It uses a wet head with a spark plug in the center of the head. The governor is of the single-weight variety. There is evidence of a nameplate at one time, but this is missing. Any help in identifying this engine will be appreciated.

23/10/11Pat and Dick Stumpf, Route 2, Box 318-F, Pierz, Minnesota, 56364, recently acquired a Ford Dexta tractor for restoration. Any information on this tractor would be most helpful.

23/10/12Don Ganzert, PO Box 360, Portland, Texas, 78374 would like to hear from any clubs devoted to the two-cylinder John Deere tractors.

23/10/13Okey W. Moffatt, Box 6782, Charleston, West Virginia 25302 writes: I have been a collector and restorer of old gas engines for many years. My attention has been mostly on large horizontal engines as used in gas compression service.

Recently I came across a set of detail drawings of a Monarch 20 x 36 inch gas engine made by H. N. Strait Mfg. Company at Kansas City. This engine was made in 1912 and operated until 1961 by a local gas company in compressor service. I have searched all sources I can find, but nothing appears so far on this company. An earlier letter to E & E Magazine has brought no replies. Any information at all on this company will be greatly appreciated.

23/10/14Gerald Whitmore, Box 104, Albion, Iowa 50005 would like to hear from anyone willing to share information on his Massey-Harris Pony tractor.

23/10/15 Q. See the photograph of a Deering threshing machine found in Remuaat, village of County Drome, France. Would like to know when it was built, how many were made, and similar information, also the correct color scheme. It also needs some replacement pulleys and the like. Can anyone help me? Mr. Bonthoux Pierre, Champ Mouton, Charantonnay, 38790 St. Georges D'Esperanche, France.

We hope that some of our readers who are knowledgeable about this machine will get in touch with Mr. Pierre!

23/10/16 Q. Here's an engine we recently acquired hanging from a tree in an old fellow's backyard. As you can see, I need a few parts to make it go again. Howard Field, Box 893, Gloucester, Virginia 23061.

A. This one is obviously of the IHC Famous series, and perhaps some of our readers might be able to contact you with some suggestions.

23/10/17 Q. I recently purchased a vertical two-cycle engine of 1 ? HP with a John Deere Plow Company nameplate. In looking through American Gasoline Engines I found this engine to be identical to the Kneeland 'Maid of all Work' illustrated on page 266. Since a few parts are missing, I would appreciate hearing from anyone with information on this engine. Patrick H. Gies, PO Box 742, Odessa, Washington 99159.

A. It is indeed curious that John Deere Plow Company sold this particular engine, although it is common knowledge that they sold Stover, New Way, R &. V, and several other makes. Send us a photo of your engine sometime.

23/10/18 Q.Ray J. Much, E6362 Hwy 22, Manawa, Wisconsin, 54949 sends a couple of photos of a horsedrawn plow for identification. He believes it to be a P. & O., but would like to know for sure. If you can help, contact Ray at the above address.

23/10/19 Q. I have a Stover diesel engine, DSL10, s/n 217599. It needs a fuel injection pump and nozzle. Can anyone tell me what is required? Also what is the correct paint color? Greg Previs, 1531 Graves Road, Sandston, Virginia, 23150.

A. First off, your engine was built May 21, 1934. It appears that the American Bosch pump needed is APF 1B 80B S53. Chances are probably slim that you will find this exact injection pump, but you may be able to find something similar. It will probably have an 8mm pump plunger. The injector should be of the AKB series-probably an AKB 80S model, built by American Bosch. We would guess that with some persistence you should be able to come up with a winning combination.

23/10/20Ralph Villil, 34 Waterleat Road, Paignton, Devon, TQ3 3UQ, England would like to correspond with those having information on a Bull Pup 1?HP engine by Bates & Edmonds Motor Company.

23/10/21Joe Morris, 1123 Irwin Road, Powell, Tennessee 37849 needs information on an Ideal lawnmower grinding machine built by Fate-Root-Heath Company, Plymouth, Ohio.

23/10/22 Q. Enclosed are photos of a six-cylinder, two-cycle marine engine built by Rochester Gas Engine Company. The s/n is 1924 and the patent date is August 27, 1907. Would anyone know the horsepower? It came with a water pump loose in a box which I think is incorrect and also uses an Atwater-Kent K-2 distributor body which is missing the cap and rotor.

The bevel gears are still there. The external mounting blocks for the distributor and its shaft are missing. Any help, photos, drawings, pictures or other information will be appreciated, as will be the correct color for this engine. David J. Opal, Box 493, Route 87, Lebanon, Connecticut, 06249.

A. Depending on the bore and stroke of course, this engine could easily be in the 50 minus-plus horsepower class. Engines of this size and number of cylinders were often given some special attention that tremendously improved the performance and were then used for boat racing. We would think that if all else fails, a six cylinder distributor system from a junked six-cylinder engine would be very adaptable. Also a distinct possibility would be a six-cylinder magneto.

23/10/23Patrick Knight, 10 Upper Elms Road, Aldershot, Hants., England has a Monitor pumping engine (Baker Mfg. Co.) and needs information in the form of instructions, approximate age, and other data such as the proper paint colors that would be helpful in restoration of same.

23/10/24 Q. Can you supply the year built for the following IHC engines: LBB41314, LBB47852, LBB44759. Also would like to know time built for a Cushman Cub R-30 engine, s/n A32237. A question, too, on a two stroke vertical drive engine with the following nameplate: Sensation Engines, 21st & Pacific, Omaha, Nebraska. Model B, 2-3HP. Jackie D. Bryan, 2714 S. Harvard, Perryton, Texas 79070.

A. The IHC engines were all built in 1945. We have no additional information on the other two engines cited in your letter.

23/10/25 Q. I have an IHC Titan starting engine and need to know the original colors. Also the proper color scheme for a Seager-Olds engine. Robert A. Johnson, Rt 2, Box 358, Canyon, Texas 79015.

A. We have no color scheme for either of the above models.

23/10/26 Q. See the photos of an unidentified engine. It bums natural gas, uses hot tube ignition, and has a 5? inch bore-There are no gears or valves. The pulley has been cast as an integral part of the flywheel. There are no markings or part numbers. We located this engine in northwestern Pennsylvania. Any help will be appreciated. William Schwartz, 122 Ormsby Ave., Pittsburgh, PA 15210.

23/10/27 Q. See the below photo of my 6HP IHC Type M engine. It uses a Wico magneto. I have the magneto but the bottom part is missing. Also need to know how to time the engine, and the pot metal fuel jets in the carburetor are broken. Billy W. Anderson, 1349 Stetson Dr. So., Cocoa, Florida 32922.

A. Setting the valve timing is the first requirement. Turn the engine so that the EXH mark on the flywheel is turned straight down and matches with a notch in the engine base. Now the rocker-arm adjusting screw can be turned in or out so as to just touch the end of the exhaust valve. Several GEM advertisers offer the replacement fuel mixer parts you need for this engine.

23/10/28Jim Miller, Box 465, Alcony Conover Road, Conover, Ohio 45317, forwards a photo of his restored Merkel motor wheel. It was patented August 27, 1915. Any information concerning this most unusual machine will be greatly appreciated.

23/10/29 Q.R. S. Couey, 24579 Adams Avenue, Murrieta, California 92362 would like to hear from someone having information on a REO motor Model 404, Type F, one-cylinder engine. It appears to be about 1? or 2HP. any information will be appreciated.

A. A Reo lawnmower is noted on page 16 of the August, 1986 GEM.

23/10/30 Q. What is the year built for a McCormick Super WD'6 tractor. It has s/n 7584J. Also, I have a WD-40 McCormick Deering. The serial tag is gone, and I was wondering how to identify it. A mark on the front of the motor reads: 2-19-35, and the one under the frame reads 2-20-35. Any help will be appreciated.Nolan Osbak, Warburg, Alta, ToC 2 To Canada.

A. It appears your tractor was built in 1944. We can't tell you for sure about the WD-40, as we don't have enough information. On the WD-40, we would guess it to be a 1935 model, the first year they were produced.

23/10/31 Q. Can anyone help us identify this old marine engine? Your help will be appreciated. W. E. Van Gulik, Trompeg 1, 7441 HN NIJVERDAL, Holland, Europe.

A. If any of our readers can help this GEM reader, drop Mr. Van Gulik a line.

23/10/32Rex Lucke, 15023 Pepperwood, Omaha, Nebraska, 68154 offers a suggestion for easing the job of cutting gaskets, and illustrates the techniques in the two photos:

Rather than trying to locate the bolt holes, then cutting or punching them out, simply lay the gasket over the mating part. Then, using a rounded object, such as a ball peen hammer, the hole can be punched out using the piece itself as a die. A few taps with a hammer and you have a clean hole that fits perfectly.


23/6/6 BN Farmall The BN was a Model B with a yoke steering assembly for a single front wheel in place of the standard dual front spindle. It worked best for truck farming but did not steer too well on the highway. As the A had a prefix of FAA, the high-wheel A of FAAV, the B of FAB, the BN of FABN, and the industrial model A of IAA, any listing of serial numbers should make it quite simple to determine the age of the tractor.

23/7/16 Seeder That is a broadcast seeder for clover, alfalfa, etc. At the time such seeders were built the regular small grain seeders for oats, wheat, etc. did not have an attachment to include the application of small seeds, so followed the regular grain seeder with this outfit. The seeder we had like the one pictured had a rope like a clothes line in the bottom of the seed tray which was worked back and forth from a cam action on the driving wheel to keep the seed flowing out of the metering holes.

The previous two answers were submitted by Lloyd Conrad, 10500 W. Carpenter Ave., Greenfield, Wisconsin, 53228-3254. Several replies were received on the grass seeder, and we thank everyone for writing.

23/7/30 McCormick-Deering engine trucksReference to the IHC Parts Catalog EC-1 covering the 1?, 3, 6, and 10 HP sizes and the 'L' l?HP size shows the various combinations used. Leigh B. Dennison, Box 873, Delta Junction, Alaska 99737.

Various and Sundry Comments:

Herb Eltz, Box 109, Triniata, Nebraska 68955 makes several comments regarding various letters to the Reflector:
1)  Saving money by making one's own carbon brushes from dry cell carbons may not be a good idea because chemicals in the carbon can cause severe corrosion.

2)  Many collectors take pride in seeing how many gallons of paint they can smear on their prize possessions. A thin coat that covers is always the best, since a heavy coat will in time, crack and peel.

3)  On the Maytag story-We have several wringer Maytags. However they were far from perfect, the wringer did not stand up and in time wound up with a big puddle of oil on floor. Gear box seal would leak and water would run in gear box forcing oil out. If the agitator was not removed after every wash it would stick and was impossible to remove. Scratch one Maytag.

4) On models-The trouble with most kits is that they are not complete. Take a gas engine kit. I bought one, only to find it was for me to find or make the crankshaft, hunt up all the screws, bolts, etc. Also, no piston rings, a spark plug was supplied, however I had a time finding a thread cutter to match it.

23/1/30 Gary Anderson's engineJim Mehegan, Rt 1, Box 39, Linville, Virginia, 22834 submits some questions in this regard:

1) Why is this engine so unlike the regular Hercules production?

2) Doesn't it have any features like the Stover?

3) Didn't Stover originate the disk flywheel, and doesn't this Hercules model seem to predate the Stover innovation?


Hot Air Engines Joe I. Lisaius, 116 Ortona Road, West Caldwell, New Jersey 07006 would like to know who might have a kit for building a small hot air engine.

Model Engine Castings and Supplies See the Advertising Section of this issue for a list of model suppliers. Kathy Petty of Pasco, Washington has worked for the past couple of years to assemble this listing, and if you're into model work, it should be well worth getting a copy.

From some very old issues of Machinery Magazine we offer some helpful shop hints in this issue. All three of these articles were printed in the early 1920's.


The accompanying illustration shows a templet that may be used advantageously for laying out keyways which must be symmetrical relative to a center line. A typical example of work on which a templet of this kind may be used is shown in the upper left-hand corner of the illustration. Ordinarily, in laying out the center line in tapered pieces such as this, considerable trouble is experienced, it being necessary to use plugs and resort to considerable calculation if a templet is not used. For accurate work, the outside of the part is seldom suitable to use as a locating surface.

The templet used for laying out the keyway in the work, and its method of application are shown in the lower part of the illustation. The templet is made from a strip of 1 /16-inch sheet steel, in which two 1/16-inch pins are assembled, In laying out the centers of these pins, it is only necessary to locate from one edge of the templet, and make the center distance equal to the center distance of the holes in the work. The only calculations required are those for obtaining the 9/64 and 17/64-inch dimensions. It will be seen that these are the differences between the radii of the two holes in the work and one-half the width of the keyway. For example, 11/32-5/64 equal 17/64 inch.

In use, the templet is placed on the work, as shown, so that the pins will seat snugly in the lowest part of the bores, and it is held in this position while a line is scribed along the upper edge of the templet to locate the lower side of the keyway. The pins in the jig project equally on each side of the 1/16-inch plate, so that by turning the templet over it may again be used for locating the other side of the keyway, the pins then being diametrically opposite the position occupied when scribing the first side of the keyway. After these two parallel lines have been scribed, an 11 /64 inch plug is inserted in the hole and a strip of steel, 5 /64inch thick, is laid tangent to it and perpendicular to the center line, so as to furnish an approximate location for scribing the depth to which the keyway is to be cut. Perhaps the greatest time-saving feature of this simple templet is the provision for using both sides by simply permitting the pins to extend through the plate. Referring to the view at A, it will be seen that if this method of assembling the pins is not followed, a tapered templet is required so that the pins may be located perpendicularly and equidistant from both angular sides. The calculation involved in laying out the center distance of the templet would also be more complicated. A templet of the type described will be found to effect a considerable saving in time in laying out a keyway, as it requires only about thirty seconds per piece.

Wilkinsburg, Pa., William S. Rowell


In the accompanying illustration is shown a convenient method of drilling holes through the center of round shafts. The button in the upper right hand corner is used to locate the spotting drill, while the shaft is held inposition by vise jaws. The buttons can be made in several sizes to correspond with the diameters of standard shafting. They should be about 0.001 inch smaller than the shafting, so that they can be removed without disturbing the piece clamped in the vise. The holes in the different buttons can all be made for the same size spotting drill. The buttons should, of course, be removed after spotting, and a drill of the required size used to drill the hole.


The device here illustrated is employed for driving the bearing bushings into the housings of an electric motor. As the bearings are of the oil-ring type, it is necessary to cut a slot or groove A in the bushing to permit the oil-ring to come in contact with the shaft. This weakens the bushing so that it is often bent or sprung at the oil slot to such an extent that a shearing cut is taken on its outer surface.

The device designed to eliminate this trouble consists of a driving mandrel B and a pilot C, which are assembled on the bushing as shown. The driving member has a collar at the upper end which is accurately machined to make a good contact with the end of the bushing D. The section of the mandrel B on which the bushing is placed is ground about 0.002 or 0.003 inch smaller than the inside diameter of the bushing, for the reason that a thin shell bushing generally shrinks 0.001 or 0.002 inch when pressed into its seat. The pilot C is also ground 0.002 inch smaller than the hole into which the bushing is to be driven. Only five or six threads are required on the end of the pilot that screws into the lower end of mandrel B. After a bushing has been pressed into place, the pilot C is unscrewed and the mandrel B withdrawn.